Posted by creggsteffler on October 2, 2008 at 1:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The kid is being charged with a "hate crime"??

Gee, that's odd... I thought the charge was =MURDER=.

How stupid to prosecute someone for having drawings of swastikas (collectors of WWII memorabilia take note). Once you've criminally taken another human being's life, then murder is what you must stand trial for.

Any dopey drawings you have in your possession are really quite secondary at that point, aren't they?

Posted by MrEFord on October 2, 2008 at 5:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

A hate crime is typically a modifier to another charge. So yes, he's being charged with murder committed as a hate crime, which adds more severe penalties to the murder charge (and also requires more things for the prosecutor to prove).

Besides that, you *do* realize that prosecutors charge people with multiple crimes all the time, even when one is particularly bad, right? Murder is not the end-all of all convictions, and it's possible to be out relatively soon after a conviction. So, I would say that it's not fair for us to have the government drop all other charges because they could conceivably lead to a longer sentence than if it was just the one big charge.

Posted by rjlebeck on October 2, 2008 at 6:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This trial is an embarrassment to the county and the school that fostered this crime. To be sure, Brandon McInerney was a confused and inwardly angry young man who did not have the necessary tools to handle the freakish overtures and alleged taunting of an equally confused and unsophisticated Larry King.

Reality check: These boys were 14 and 13 years of age! The county District Attorney, whom TECHUSER somehow confuses with a leftist whacko, is mounting a prosecution that would seek to paint the killer as the incarnate of evil. The murder of Larry King is an indictment of a society that has lost its sense of balance and justice. The real evil is in a justice system devoid of mercy and a correctional system that sends people to prison not as punishment, but for punishment (i.e. to be raped of both body and mind). How can we as a society continue to look ourselves in the mirror and pretend how good we are when we imprison more of our own people than any other country in the world?

As a member of a jury on this trial, I would acquit Brandon by reason of jury nullification. Any law that would consider treating a 14-year-old as an adult is morally and legally absurd.

Posted by darrgjj on October 2, 2008 at 7:17 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Its about Totten and his groupies... Get Totten out and you wont have a 14yr. old being tried as an adult. Brandon can believe in whatever it is he wants to believe in. I hardly believe the "White Power" stuff lead to this. Do you people know what school in went to,and if so what was the majority? He had friends of all colors. This was a young boy being overly pursued by a GAY boy and having to put up w/ being teased about it. He should not have killed him but he should not be prosecuted by Totten and his people as if he is a MAN full of hate and prejudice.

Posted by goldeneye on October 2, 2008 at 7:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Finally, we get the full picture on this little monster. He shoots a gay boy in a crowded classroom because he is a Nazi and filled with hate. Now it comes full circle. I'm only sorry that he won't be executed for his crimes.

Posted by Ms_California on October 2, 2008 at 7:34 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This was an adult crime and should lead to an adult punishment. This would be no different (and I have said this before) if a girl killed a boy for sexual harrasment. Do you think she would be given a break? Honestly, no. Kids are teased everyday in school, is it right? no, can we stop it? no. Parents need to step up and get involved with their children, their friends, their teachers and the school itself. Larry didn't deserve to die because he was self proclaimed gay... no one does; white, black, brown or purple! The fact of the matter is Brandon was teased and based on his home life his way of dealing or taking care of his problems was to shoot a gun. Do I think Brandon is an adult, no I don't but he committed an adult crime. He premeditated this act going as far as telling other students he was going to kill Larry. Was it a reach for attention, maybe, was it something that could have been possibly prevented by many people involved, absolutely. Is our justice system wrong for prosecuting a person for a terrible crime, not at all. I personally don't believe that the court system has a personal or group vendeta to prosecute Brandon. I don't think he is being singled out and attacked by the courts. He shot and killed a fellow classmate, in cold blood in front of other children. How would you feel if your child was sitting in that classroom witnessing this event? Better yet how would you feel if your child was shot to death because of how he/she looked or acted. Let's think outside of the court case itself and take a good look at the actions and reactions of our children and how we as parents can help protect and teach them in their early lives! If you want to stand on your soapbox do it for good use and stop blaming parties other than the actual killer!

Posted by lawabider on October 2, 2008 at 7:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)

All those in favor of this huge travesty of justice are so obviously NOT WHITE it's disgusting even to me. I doodle all the time. Now I'm wondering what my little drawings could lead to in my future? A White Supremist Nazi could not have black and Jewish friends. Are there no brains left in America at all??? I want to see charges against both sets of parents, the school and the care home that housed Larry. All were criminally negligent in my book!

Posted by zany on October 2, 2008 at 7:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Maybe I am ignorant to exactly what a white supremacist is, but if there is a hate crime involved, would it not just be a hate crime against gays because that seems to be the reason the boy was murdered. Oi, only the shooter knows for sure......

Posted by Logic_andFreedom on October 2, 2008 at 7:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes, MOSTLY this IS about the D.A. He's using this trial to set himself up for a higher office. Totten is sensationalizing the Press for his own personal noteriety.

Larry King being a little gay child wasn't the problem. His sexual preference was NOT the problem.
Larry King's big mouth WAS the problem. HE should've kept his mouth shut and not taunted others. Truly this child had social problems. If it wasn't now, it would've been later on the streets that Larry would've died from doing the same thing: taunting others.

The school SHOULD have intervened.
Schools need more staffing though. Budget cuts by our Gov. are bad.

Posted by cslaurie on October 2, 2008 at 7:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

All it takes is one jury member to decide 13 year old and some odd days children are not eligible to be prosecuted as adults. The hate crime enhancement is BS and plays to inflame a jury.

Posted by Thinkbeforeyoupost on October 2, 2008 at 7:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

rjlebeck; Couldn't have said it better myself. Ignore Tuchuser, he(or she) believes everyone who doesn't think like him(or her) is an idiot. Of course most of us don't agree with him(or her) so I guess that makes us all idiots. Lets remember folks Brandon is 14 years old. Were you mature at 14? If you say yes, you are a liar!

Posted by Ms_California on October 2, 2008 at 7:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)

How is Totten going to gain a career advantage from this case? Did he pay Brandon to kill this child and create the drama? Did he ask Larry to become gay and tease? Wake up.... this isn't going to skyrocket Totten's career. Why would it be any different if this was two men the ages of 30 & 31? It wouldn't!

Just for the record, I am white with a very traditional German last name.. does that make me a Nazi?

Posted by 805grl on October 2, 2008 at 7:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What I think is sick? Is the people here who think McInerney deserves a slap on the wrist! Thats sick..he did what he did, he knew what he was doing, and he is a white supremacist wannabe! Would it be different if it were a gang banger wanna be? Then would it be ok to send him away for life if he committed a similar crime? I think people are fooled by his picture in the paper and are blinded by his age-he knew exactly what he was doing!!...I think King deserved a slap on the wrist for his actions against McInerney- not murdered in cold blood.

Posted by Adam_Monroe on October 2, 2008 at 8:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I've seen minorities that attack other minorities be charged with hate crimes. I've also heard of many people attacking people of differing sexual orientation charged with hate crimes. And lastly, I've heard of attacks against people of the Jewish faith leading to a hate crime charge...

Anybody can be charged with a hate crime so please get off your little "poor me the minorities have it so much better than us" soap box.

This kid deserves to spend the rest of his days behind bars...he took a life. Regardless of the details of that life (gay, straight, white, black), it was a life nonetheless and he must now answer for that appropriately...

Posted by hotwildflower on October 2, 2008 at 8:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have never seen anyone say that Brandon deserves a slap on the wrist, but I do think that his age (which I don't feel blinds us, yet sheds light on things) leads us to believe that he wasn't capable of thinking through his actions and the true consequences. YES, he MUST be punished and yes, I think that the youth punishment may be a bit too lax but I firmly believe the 51 years is too much.

I also don't think this was a hate crime in the true definition, he didn't hate him because he was gay or because he was half black, he hated him because of who he was and this really should have been addressed by staff members at the school. Even Larry's brother told the staff he was concerned about the way his brother was behaving...is that not a cry of help or what??

It's like a bunch of blood thirsty people who can't see this is a CHILD and royally screwed up.

Posted by hotwildflower on October 2, 2008 at 8:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I disagree. He was not deranged, he was a good student in honors classes. He was active in yout sports and obviously had alot of friends and was well liked. Does that sound like a derganged person to you? Does that sound like someone planning to become the next leader of a hate group? It doesn't to me!

He is a child who was obviously pushed to his limits and commited a horrible and unforgivable act.

Posted by Ms_California on October 2, 2008 at 8:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)

njnnp... Larry was put to death!

Posted by Ms_California on October 2, 2008 at 8:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

njnnp... no worries but on here with that mistake not corrected you would have been in shark invested waters! haha

Posted by surfing93035 on October 2, 2008 at 9 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have read some of the most ridiculous posts ever!
People are having issues with the "Hate Crime" stigma. And saying they were "just kids".

Facts: Little punk was a Nazi or pretended to be.
He brought a gun to school and killed a classmate. Pre-meditated = Murder. 13 or 14 or 10..The kid knew what he was doing. This is Murder period. There are special circumstances that should allow him to be tried as an adult. He committed an adult crime. I am soooo sick and tired of people sticking up for, and excusing criminal behavior. Show the Pay per view execution of this little scum bag and give the money to the victims poor family. The Nazi's parents or should i say ( More than likely 1 parent) who has to work 2 jobs..is out of luck. Next time pay attention to your kids!

Posted by GDOG5 on October 2, 2008 at 9:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What a Shame.....
The kid should NOT be tried as adult! The age of him commiting this crime does not warrant such extreme measures. Yes, he took a life, but this is a kid were talking about. Someone who brain has not matured, and I'm sure did not realize the extend of his crime. But this we can be sure of, a kid being being harrased by another kid that has his own issue's of his sexual orientation. For those who have teenagers or can remember what it is like growing up (these day's are much harder now too). I'm sure you can relate to the social issue's not to mention peer pressure these kids must have been going through. In no way I'm I exusing what he did, and there should be a consequence but not as an Adult!

Posted by hotwildflower on October 2, 2008 at 9:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)

surfing...can you find his actual parents? No one seems to know who or where they are. He had adoptive parents who washed their hands of him and turned him over to the state and NOW want money for their loss...they deserve NO money for ANYTHING!

Posted by keem_s on October 2, 2008 at 9:10 a.m.

(This thread was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by Whodathunkit on October 2, 2008 at 9:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Long ago those younger than these boys were appointed rulers and kings over nations...nowadays, we have put the age of 18 to be considered a "legal adult". Both of these boys are/were young men, no longer little boys, and the fact of the matter is murder was committed!!! How many excuses must be made for those who commit crimes such as these? Age, family background, mental status, on and on...McInerney had no right to take a life for ANY reason, and should be punished for this crime to the highest extent of the law. My heart goes out to his family, as well as Larry King's family.

Posted by dse_kpa on October 2, 2008 at 9:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)

EYE FOR AN EYE...

Posted by keem_s on October 2, 2008 at 9:36 a.m.

(This thread was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 9:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)

As a survivor of homicide I feel that just punishment is necessary. Even at ages 13-14 we know right from wrong. Justice must be served at all ages to ensure that our children realize that crimes will not go unpunished.

In saying that, I don't think I agree with an adult punishment. I realize that 9 years in a juvenile detention facility is to little for murder especially one with special circumstances like a hate crime and pre-meditation. But, I'm still not sure about the trying him as an ADULT. I don't think it will serve his crime as justice.

Like I said, I'm not sure...though I think I'm leaning to, it's not a good idea to try him as an adult. I'll have to see as the trial continues if I change my mind, but at 14 he new right from wrong, but was his brain fully developed? It's hard to say.

Posted by alex.poet on October 2, 2008 at 9:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

"As a member of a jury on this trial, I would acquit Brandon by reason of jury nullification. Any law that would consider treating a 14-year-old as an adult is morally and legally absurd."

As this was decided by a judge to be an adult trial, you would never EVER make it past jury selection. So your point is null.

So what the STAR needs to realize is that they need to explain what the Hate Crime modifier will do to the murder charge. (STAR are you reading? - you got some explaining to do in your articles)

The murder count and the gun possession count already remove the possibility of parole. The hate crime count includes 1 - 3 additional years also without the possibility of parole.

While this does not seem like much now, where this will have a large impact of the civil suit that the King's will bring against the McInerney's.

http://ag.ca.gov/civilrights/pdf/laws... states that because of The Bane Act, plaintiffs can sue for civil penalties for perpetrators, civil remedies to victims of
"hate violence," three times actual damages, but no less than $1000, punitive damages,
injunctive and other equitable relief (violation of the injunctive relief is punishable by a
criminal contempt action, with a penalty of six months in jail and/or a fine not exceeding
$1000) and attorney’s fees.

This should amount to a pretty penny for the Kings. My question is this, if Brandon is tried as an adult, then are his parents liable for his actions?

Posted by icanilluminateu on October 2, 2008 at 10:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It's important to remember than Brandon shot Larry TWICE!! That indicates he knew what he was doing and intended to kill him.

That is why he should be tried as an adult.

Posted by icanilluminateu on October 2, 2008 at 10:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes it does. It indicates intent

Posted by rebel123 on October 2, 2008 at 10:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have to say this....

Knowing how boys at this age act, it is my opinion that Brandon's actions were motivated far less by Larry's actual alleged advances than by the probable torment and teasing he received from the other boys after that which likely took the form of hazing Brandon about his masculinity. It is highly likely the other boys razed him unmercifully and he didn't have the tools to deal with an assault on his fragile adolescent male ego. I do not believe that this boy acted out of some bizarre neo-Nazi belief. He clearly is a very disturbed kid. I also believe that it is the height of hypocrisy to call the victim a child and his killer an adult when they are both the same age.

Posted by icanilluminateu on October 2, 2008 at 10:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Rebel
I agree with you 90%. But I disagree that Brandon should be tried as a child. By 14 he should know that shooting a person is wrong and a criminal act. That's the basis for trying him as an adult. And the fact that he pulled the trigger TWICE indicates he knew what he was doing.

I also feel that this shooting was avoidable had the school done more. Now, many, many lives will be forever affected by this tragedy.

Posted by HereWeGoAgain on October 2, 2008 at 11:32 a.m. (Suggest removal)

If his skin was dark what would everyone be saying then? Think about how everyone reacts when it is a minority who commits a crime. Treat this kid the same way. People have made stronger comments about what they would like to see done to taggers. This boy killed someone for gods sake! I feel bad for him but I feel worse for the kid who is dead.

Posted by rebel123 on October 2, 2008 at 11:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)

icanilluminateu: it's not whether or not Brandon knew killing someone is wrong. Even a child much younger knows killing is wrong. The questions to ask is whether or not Brandon had the mental development to fully and completely think through the action/consequences of what he did. Neurologists will tell you the part of the brain that analyzes our actions (in advance) and then connects those actions to all the various consequences is not completely developed in males until their early twenties. Kids his age frequently have very unrealistic ideas about consequences, if they even think about them at all. Which is why teens make so many stupid decisions and explains why they often seem to fly in the face of logic and reason. I also believe that as a society we have to be consistent in how we identify a "child". If this kid isn't allowed to drive, vote, marry, join the army or even buy cigarettes, by what logic do we say he isn't old enough or responsible enough for those activities, yet once a crime is committed and we need vengeance, we call him an adult.

Posted by bbbdugout on October 2, 2008 at 12:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

don't forget these things are taught - we are not born to hate - parents, relatives, and/or so called friends teach hate for others - then you find someone that is receptive to this - in this case it sounds like it was Brandon - who still knows the difference between wrong and right and made a choice - a choice that may cost him his life in prison or worse - but HE made that choice

Posted by butterflygone on October 2, 2008 at 12:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

RIP Larry. He did not deserve to die no matter if/how he teased Brandon. If Brandon was grown enough to take another child's life, he could have been grown enough to report Larry's supposed teasing to a teacher, parent, someone. Bottom line: murder is murder is murder. He deserves to pay the price. It's scary that a kid is capable of this. Hopefully he won't be allowed to grow into an adult monster walking the streets targeting anyone and everyone else. He was not an adult, but he was old enough to know taking another life is wrong.

Posted by timbri27 on October 2, 2008 at 12:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I've said this before and I will say it again, Brandon is a murderer no matter what. I have two kids and nieces and knephews and if someone ever takes their lives, I would want justice. Stop trying to excuse this Criminal. Larry's crime was, according to some of you, harrassment, teasing, haveing a big mouth, being gay..etc. His punishment for his crime was death. Brandon's crime is MURDER what should be his punishment?

Posted by eclipsewatcher on October 2, 2008 at 1:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This white supremacist crap starts in the home. According to yesterday's article, a “trove” of white supremacist material was found in Brandon's room at home. Today's article says “numerous” items were found. That Brandon was in possession of this type of material AT ALL would make me inclined to believe that he was at least on the path to becoming a full-fledged white supremacist. Oh, but eclipse watcher, he was just a baby doodling swastikas. Yeah, sure. Did he understand the ideology that Tom Metzger and David Lane represent (which is twisted in my opinion)? Maybe. Maybe not. But I would hardly call an almost 15-year-old in possession of white supremacist material a baby doodling pretty crosses.

The parents of this young man sound as bad as the parents of the two Columbine perpetrators, who had no idea that their sons were building bombs in their own garages. The word clueless doesn't even begin to cover it.

Well, neo-Nazi garbage aside, it does not diminish the fact that Brandon took a life. Whether he should be tried as an adult for his crime and sentenced accordingly . . . I'm still torn.

Posted by rebel123 on October 2, 2008 at 1:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The fact that Brandon resorted to murder instead of reporting the alleged harassment speaks to the lack of maturity in his thought processes. I am not excusing what he did by any stretch. I think that a big part of the problem is that the punishment for murder by a "child" is too lenient an that is why this boy is being labeled an adult. But I also feel that it does not serve society one bit to try him as an adult. Throwing him in an adult institution until he's in his 50's pretty much guarantees he'll leave the very monster you fear. Our adult prisons do not reform. They simply incarcerate.

Posted by mamaof2 on October 2, 2008 at 1:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

HereWeGoAgain: "People have made stronger comments about what they would like to see done to taggers." That is so true and at the same time very sad, if Brandon happend to be in a gang the comments on here would be worse and I bet almost everybody here would think he should be charged as an adult. Then the whole hispanic race will get bashed as usual.

Nevertheless no matter how Brandon is Judged in front of our judicial system he will one day face the greatest judgement of all and then he will suffer the the harshest punishement of them all...

Posted by icanilluminateu on October 2, 2008 at 1:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Rebel
Some excellent points!

Posted by Thinkbeforeyoupost on October 2, 2008 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Tiquisiaprincess; How can you be a survivor of a homicide? No one survives homicide. As far as the Larry/Brandon thing goes, Brandon went to school officials and told them he had a problem with Larry. They did nothing. Larry was not told to limit is gay actions by wearing appropriate clothing and not wearing makeup to school. Larry had serious social problems and Brandon had them as well. If Larry was considered a child, then Brandon must also be considered a child. Brandon needs to pay for what he did, but 51 years to life is too harsh for a 14 year old. Larry's parents, and Brandon's parents need to be held accountable for some of the problems with these two boys. The school needs to be held accountable. Larry's consular, who could have prevented this, but because of her own gay issue's didn't, should be held accountable. Society should be held responsible for not making every school in this Country a safe haven for our kids. This is truly a sad, sad situation.

Posted by oxnardian23m on October 2, 2008 at 2:09 p.m.

(This thread was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 2:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I TOLD YOU SO!!! I TOLD YOU SO!!!! WHERE'S JRMAFIA??? I've been saying this from the get go...my sources were correct.

Posted by HICKSEK on October 2, 2008 at 2:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I fill sorry for both familys envolved but the point of the matter is that Brandon was well aware of what he was doing. Why did he have access to a gun anyway. Do an adult crime, do the adult time.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This was a pre-meditated, hateful, violent murder. Brandon knew darn well what he was doing. He told classmates that it was "Larry's last day". All you defenders of this murderer cannot possibly "believe" your B.S. "excuses" being made for his actions that day. He ALWAYS had the option for a less violent act, he CHOSE not to take that route and CHOSE to end Larry's life that day. Two shots are NOT an accident. Shooting him on the back of the head only proves how cowardly he was acting. If Brandon was a hispanic from Colonia Chiques...we'd be hearing all these "excuse-makers" crying about how "those types" should be exiled on an island or some other hair-brain idea that I've read on these boards. Quit being hypocrites! Larry didn't deserve the fate handed out by Brandon. Brandon needs to pay for what he did...plain and simple.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thinkbeforeyoupost...sorry
I'm a survivor of homicide victim...that'll clarify it.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3 p.m. (Suggest removal)

thinkbeforeyoupost: Your logic is flawed. Larry was treated like a child so Brandon should be treated like a child. You're equating wearing high heels and teasing Brandon to cold-blooded, premeditated murder? You're a little off. You're comparing apples to oranges.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 3:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thinkbeforeyoupost..."Society should be held responsible for not making every school in this Country a safe haven for our kids."

I happen to agree with this post. Something needs to be done about our schools. Personally they all need to go to uniforms and ENSURE the uniform code is followed. This should bring down peer pressure "some" not all but some since you don't have the pressure of "how to dress". Also, our State and Country need to make our schools safer. It's ridiculous to live in fear while you're at work and your children are at school, because you don't know if they'll make it home on that day. Something has got to be done and I say Uniforms will help and open it up to more possibilities.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

TiquisiaPrincess: It has to start at home with the parents. Parents need to be involved in raising their kids vs. leaving them to outside influences that only work to corrupt their already impressionable minds. Schools can only do so much and only so much is the fault of the school. Unless they "frisk" each and every student, there's no way to tell who's going to do what. So the best thing is to nip it at the bud and make parents accountable for their kids actions and better yet, for their role as parents and how they raise their children.

I understand though...since it doesn't require much more thought...it's MUCH easier to simply blame the schools for the kid's behaviors and social development. That's a whole other problem.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ImMadAs: Free speech doesn't apply on these boards. If it's the GOVERNMENT censoring you...THEN...free speech comes into play. These VCStar boards clearly state their rules.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

NJNNP: To your 2nd point...The school district is allowed to designate a dress code. Larry was NOT in violation of the code (techically). "Girls" are NOT allowed to wear heels....does not specifically say "Boys". Regardless of his orientation, Larry was still a "Boy". Silly technicality, but still applicable.

Posted by HereWeGoAgain on October 2, 2008 at 3:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy- thank you for putting it so bluntly. If this boy was dark skinned (black or hispanic) there would be so many hatefull things being said. Whether it was gang related or not.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 3:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01 I agree with most of your post, however, I still think that to help society our schools should all go to uniform. I thik we would see a nice change in the "peer pressure" problems. Nothing wrong with going to uniforms. The problem is that when it's discussed not only do the students raise hell but so do the parents.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

NJNNP: I'm not arguing with you...I'm just saying that there was a dress code...it WAS being followed. The school was not in violation of enforcement of said dress code.

Just sayin' is all. (TM)

Posted by Thinkbeforeyoupost on October 2, 2008 at 3:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01; I am not saying that Brandon is excused for his actions, he is not! He took a life and that is not excusable. However, shouldn't we put some of the blame on his parents? Where did he get access to the gun? Shouldn't we put some blame on the school for allowing Brandon to get a gun into the school? Shouldn't we cast some blame on the consular who allowed Larry to become a target? Shouldn't we blame Larry's parent's for not caring about him enough that they gave up on him and placed him in Casa Pacifica and basically washed their hands of him? Do you think that a 14 year old is so tarnished that he can't ever be taught that his actions were not acceptable? If we put him in prison for 51 years, what is the purpose of even letting him live? What possible use of his life will be? He would be 65 years old when allowed to parole and he will never be qualified for SSI. His whole life would only be a drain of tax payers money. Is there no hope at all for a 14 year old boy? He would have no training to even be able to work. This is what the DA wants? Either we get him psychiatric help for , Oh let's say 20 years, or put him to death, but they aren't seeking the death penalty. What will the purpose of his life be for? Prison is NOT reform. It is warehousing! If he isn't a total killer mad dog now, then when he gets out he will be!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Tiquisia: MOST "complaining" Parents see it as "another" expense. They see it as tedious. I agree that in theory, uniforms would help...but at this point, it'd be kinda difficult to enforce in public schools with a wide range of severely low-income parents and average income parents either not having the means or having the means. It still leaves you with the problem of...what if a student can't afford to buy uniforms?...still creates disparities among students. In private schools, they can enforce the dress code because you're paying for your kid to go there...but in exchange, the school sets certain requirements of both the kids and the parents. Just sayin.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:33 p.m. (Suggest removal)

thinkbeforeyoupost: No. He "took" the gun from his grandfather's collection. Like I said before, unless the school "frisks" each and every student, NO, the school cannot be held accountable for a student sneaking a gun to school. The counselor could have told Larry whatever she wanted, we all know teenagers still do what they want to do. Larry's parents, while probably f'ed up...cannot be blamed for his death. They gave up, yes, that makes them horrible parents to give up on their own child, it does not make them liable for his death. Yes, I DO think THIS 14 yr old is so tarnished that he deserves at least 51 years without freedom. He should get the death penalty, but that won't fly nowadays. Again, Brandon CHOSE to kill...I would have NO problem siding with you on this had he beat the crap outta Larry and if Larry died from the beating....because Brandon could not have expected Larry to die from a severe beating, but he COULD EASILY expect Larry to die as a result of two shots to the back of the head. It's not like he shot him from a car and ran...THEN..I would side with you....he "executed" Larry. That's life in prison or the death penalty in MY book.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 3:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01,
I can tell you that the expense part is really an excuse. It is less expensive to buy uniforms than it is regular clothers throughout the year. I say this from experience. Target, wallmart these clothes sell very inexpensive uniforms.

Also, elementary schools went to uniforms in oxnard. It took a while, but they all did it (or most). Fact is, that the problem is really in high school cause the kids want to dress any which way they want and many times leave home dressed one way and get to school and change to other way.

Right now public schools have a dress code, but it's not followed. I am appalled have the time when driving to school and seeing what some of these kids dress like. It's like if I was visiting a party bar.

It's a start is all I'm saying.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 3:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You know that's the sad part of it. at 14 he will get no reform in prison. This is all very difficult. I would hate to be on this jury..not that I could, cause I couldn't...but just thinking of sending this kid to prision for life, is scary.

Yet, scarier to know that he killed someone and they will never live or also have the possibility of reform, should they have wanted it.

It's a very harsh place to be in. I don't know how to feel about it.

Posted by handyhood on October 2, 2008 at 3:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01- I believe that thinkbeforeyoupost is saying exactly that. If they are going to try him for murder, then execute him instead of warehousing him in prison for 51 years! I agree with think on who is at fault also. He had access to a gun through his grandfather. He should not have ever had access. Larry's parent failed him. The school failed him. His lesbian consular failed him. Society failed him (yes on 8). Same thing with Brandon. My son is a guard at the youth facility and he has told me that Brandon is a white supremest. Where did he get that but at home. Fix him or kill him but don't waste time and money on him.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 3:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

handyhood: failing him is not the same as "liable for his death". There's only 1 person that's liable for Larry's death and that's Brandon. That's why I don't agree with the district potentially having to pay out to Larry's foster parents. That's BS.

oh...and NO on 8! Really. It won't ruin the sanctity of MY marriage...Let loved ones get married. Don't be a homo-phob!

Posted by lawabider on October 2, 2008 at 4 p.m. (Suggest removal)

eclipsewatcher: he was not "almost 15" -- he had only turned 14 days before the murder... this same article poses all the same arguments for BOTH sides and nothing is ever resolved in here. He was also studying WWII in school at the time of his "doodlings" -- read more before you speak and save yourself some embarrassment already?

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 4:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

lawabider: With a 1.9GPA...how much "studying" do you think was actually going on? So studying about slavery makes it OK to call a black person the "N-Word"? It's still offensive and cannot be used as an excuse. Besides, according to one of my sources, he also hung out with a group of guys that were "tolerance-challenged". Surely one could put the pieces together on THAT part of the puzzle no?

Posted by eclipsewatcher on October 2, 2008 at 4:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

lawabider: Save yourself some embarrassment. When I studied WWII in school, I was not in possession of white supremacist propaganda. Had I been, my school would have expelled me, and my parents would have taught me a lesson I would never have forgotten.

Posted by blackfoot on October 2, 2008 at 4:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

JayRemE I disagree that there's nothing the school could have done. In our gun-riddled society, any school that doesn't have metal detectors is asking for trouble. School authorities are too busy planning their next vacation to listen to a kid complain about anything! so I suppose you're right on that note.

Posted by maryemapa on October 2, 2008 at 4:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Eclipsewatcher, when you studied WWII in school, especially if you grew up in Oxnard, you did not have access to the Internet, or Borders/Barnes and Noble bookstores. That kind of stuff is not hard to get. If you came to my house now, you might wonder why I have books like Nazi Doctors and Hitler's Henchmen. Some people are fascinated with that era.

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 4:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Let's be honest. I'm always for defending parents when their kids are over 18 and so forth. But honestly, he was 14 years old, just turned 14. SOMEONE in his home, his parents should be held responsible.

Hey I have NO PROBLEM going through my kids room. I don't care if it's her personal space and I should trust and so on and so on. While my kid is under my roof, I'll go into the room and check it out every so often to see what's happening that I may not know about. Cause you know what...no matter how well you know your kids...there's always something you don't know about.

If I found my kid with anything that might resemble "racial" I'd have no problem giving her the phone to dial 911 while I beat some sense. :-)

Posted by eclipsewatcher on October 2, 2008 at 4:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Maryemapa: When I studied WWII, I did not have access to the Internet. But I did have access to bookstores and the public library. At least in my mind, there's a big difference between the information you're going to get from those sources and the inflammatory PROPAGANDA you're going to get from members of the local Aryan Nation chapter.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 4:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)

maryemapa: So it's just a coincidence that he happened to kill the homosexual student that was bugging him instead of just popping him in the mouth? Need I remind you that neo-nazi types include the homosexual community as part of the target of their hatred.

Posted by handyhood on October 2, 2008 at 4:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

To everyone; It is definitely a different world than the one we grew up in. Society has to change with it. We cannot continue to put blinders on and expect everything to be alright.
BabyzDaddy_01; prop 8 doesn't really have anything to do with homosexuality. It has to do with 4 judges having the right to usurp their will against the population. The only reason this has become a gay issue is because of the gay lobbying that has made it so. I don't like 4 judges telling the people of this State that their vote does not mean anything, and that's exactly what happened! Don't get me started:)

Posted by TiquisiaPrincess on October 2, 2008 at 4:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

handyhood it's true and i know what you mean. Didn't judges choose our president too? :-)

Posted by handyhood on October 2, 2008 at 4:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

princess; Like I said, don't get me started:)

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 4:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

handyhood: That low voter turnout during the time that was put up on the ballot was HARDLY the will of the people....If it's not related to gay issues...then why did you even bring it up when referring to Larry?

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 5:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ImaHomoPhobAndImNotGoingToTakeItAnymore: that's a whole other article comments board pal....

Posted by Ventura22 on October 2, 2008 at 5:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Perfect examples of bad parenting for both kids that led to this circumstance. Nazi's hated homosexuals too, and sent them to the death camps along with the jews. Parents show some leadership and take control of your kids; you are responsible for their actions.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 2, 2008 at 5:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"you liberals"...you're funny!

Posted by Equitable_Enforcer on October 2, 2008 at 5:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If politicians and the courts continue to try to manipulate people's minds as with SB 777 which ostensibly is an anti-discrimination measure but is much more, these problems will continue and it will get worse. The courts are trying to make everyone accept a lifestyle that to most is repugnant. Lawyers can't change how people feel. Anti-discrimination, fine. But, keep sexual preferences and bizarre behavior in the bedroom and particularly out of the schools. Don't push them on kids or on me. The fact that Larry's champion in the school was a Jewish Lesbian just added more fuel to the fire if Brandon was already favoring white supremacy. Brandon may be guilty of murder, but the school could most likely have prevented it from happening. Larry appeared to have been suffering from Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). If that was so, the King's approach was the right one and, if followed by Casa Pacifica and others, Larry wouldn't have been killed.

Posted by 805Nana_1 on October 2, 2008 at 5:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If it was not for the 14 Words and the number 88 (HH) found drawn on the papers, I might be able to buy the excuse that he was studying about WWII. But come on people, those two things are part of the Skinhead/White Supremist ideology. That has nothing to do with WWII.

Get your heads out of the sand. If he was anything but white, you would be calling for his head.

Posted by luv2sail on October 2, 2008 at 7:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I fully agree that this is a horrible crime and should be dealt with within the boundries of the law. That being said, you cannot convict a 14 year old as an adult. I'm not even certain if you should be able to convict an 18 year old as an adult. After all, shouldn't an adult be able to have a c---tail? An 18 year old can get shipped out to war and kill but can't have a beer? Time to rethink the whole "adult" timeline.

Posted by ironwoman on October 2, 2008 at 7:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This isn't about "age"...this is about murder. People are forgetting the ACT, which is MURDER. It's not about drinking at a certain age or going to war. This is about the seriousness of the offense...Murder is as serious as it gets...age or not, the act was committed and the person needs to be out of society for public safety.

Posted by handyhood on October 2, 2008 at 8:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

babyz; if the will of the people is the will of the only people who voted then THAT'S the WILL of the people. Don't blame the fact that prop 22 passed on low voter turn out. That's a cop out! This is why we vote! If you choose not to vote then you have no right to agree or disagree with the end result. Can you say D E M O C R A C Y! I knew you could:)The liberal leftist and Gay community have made this about Gays being able to marry, however there are civil contracts that can legally mean the same thing if they choose to use them. No, this is about 4 judges and a gay community trying to stick it our face that they don't care what anyone else thinks, but only care about what their agenda is. The courts are screwed up and Brandon being charged as an adult and the striking of prop 22 prove it.

Posted by Thinkbeforeyoupost on October 2, 2008 at 8:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Handyhood; Well said! If I could give you applause through the post my hands would be clapping.

Posted by toxicweedy_writer on October 2, 2008 at 8:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Brandon killed Larry because he devalued him as a human being.. point blank. regardless of what they are charging him with. brandon didnt think larry deserved to breathe, hence, why he killed him. regardless of what they found in his room, he was taught to hate and devalue any one who was indifferent from him.
I dont hold Larry up as a martyr because thats what the majority of the community is doing.. i just think its terrible that this is what its come to now-a-days.. you cant just let people be. i try to teach my niece and nephew peace and tolerence because every one is different. its just crap how people make excuses for one's sole decision.. if Brandon was a mexican and he killed a mexican every one would just assume that its gang related and go on a verbal bash of mexicans for raising their children the wrong way.. but since he is white and was known to associate with supremacists and found material that proved it.. people are making excuses for his actions. its crap.
face it, people make stupid decisions in life.. some more serious than others. but their is no reason why any one should be making excuses for this kid. he was taught to hate any one who was different. this kid will never feel the wind of freedom on his back ever again in his natural life.

Posted by Ventura22 on October 2, 2008 at 8:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Straying off the subject of the tragic shooting: Let's not forget that we the voters supported and voted for those who wrote the anti-discrimination laws that protect ALL of us from being denied rights and discriminated against for a number of things. The judicial system is merely applying the laws. This isn't the first "voter-approved" measure to be tossed, found to violate laws or found unconstitutional and it sure as hell won't be the last. It's called a system of checks and balances and it's working exactly as designed in this case so deal with it! Those of you out there accusing the courts of agendizing things need to remember that it could end-up one day being YOU that those same courts are protecting from poorly written measures/bills that slip through the cracks and sneak their way to and past the ballot box. Be thankful the courts are merely doing their job of applying the law equally and fairly, regardless of the race/nationality/gender/religion/sexual preference of the persons in question, even if it may not suit your personal beliefs or own life choices. I do not choose homosexuality as a lifestyle but I also do not believe they or anyone should be discriminated against, and denying someone something because of the items listed constitutes discrimination. God Bless America and if you have a problem with the things I wrote, please feel free to board the next one-way flight to China, Africa or Russia. I'll be happy to help pay your airfare. Then write a postcard and tell us about how they protect you from discrimination and ensure your rights & equality. We live in a free country and sometimes that means some things may not always suit our personal beliefs; that's a small price to bear for the freedoms we are blessed with here. The alternative is far less accomodating for anyone and those who have fought in foreign wars know what I am talking about.

Posted by NavalAviator on October 2, 2008 at 9:23 p.m.

(This thread was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by rickcwood on October 2, 2008 at 9:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This is why we homeschool.

Posted by Logic_andFreedom on October 2, 2008 at 10:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

WHAT?! ARE YOU RUNNING FOR SOMETHING? Ms CALIORNIA..??
The DA would NOT be in the press if it were about 31 yrs olds. Get over YOURSELF.

Ms_California wrote:
How is Totten going to gain a career advantage from this case? Did he pay Brandon to kill this child and create the drama? Did he ask Larry to become gay and tease? Wake up.... this isn't going to skyrocket Totten's career. Why would it be any different if this was two men the ages of 30 & 31? It wouldn't!

Posted by Logic_andFreedom on October 2, 2008 at 11 p.m.

(This thread was removed by the site staff.)

Posted by nancy_4ever on October 3, 2008 at 12:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Parents who don't step in and take charge of items in their home, in their son or daughter's room, are cowards. Parenting is hard, with long term effects, positive and negative. It's your way or the highway - don't make it easy for your children to make grave mistakes. Fight for what's right. Even if the fight begins in your child's room. This kid needed supervision and intervention - by his parents.

Posted by idonttinkso on October 3, 2008 at 9:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What next? Now Totten is raiding houses on the beach trying to connect others with this murder. Branden acted on his own.
Totten I know is election time but stop grasping. Keep others out of it.

Posted by brown_eyes on October 3, 2008 at 2:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)

this may have been a hate crime in the fact that larry was gay but to leap and say thing like white and mexican come on do they have nothing to charge this kid, not an adult a child. he killed someone in a class room where other kids saw..to say he is an adult is far from it 18yrs old isnt even an adult they can vote and die for us but not drink until 21. this kid cannt even drive how can anyone think he's an adult he did a very stupid thing and as an adult he wouldnt have reacted that way..it may be a hate crime but dont throw race into into something with sexual orientation.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 3, 2008 at 3:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

brown_eyes: WTF?!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on October 3, 2008 at 3:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

handyhood: I love the way you would cry DEMOCRACY when it's to your advantage. By the way....how will YOU be affected if Prop 8 does NOT pass? Seriously. It won't cost you more money. You won't pay more in taxes. You won't lose your job over this. Two people that love each other will have the same rights are a man and a woman that are married. I still do not see how this will impact you, unless you are homophobic...then you won't be able to sleep (I imagine).

Posted by SoSad on October 3, 2008 at 4:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You know what, when adults commit crimes, they don't stand around waiting for the cops to pick them up, they RUN and HIDE too.

Yes, Brandon is a child, but he committed a horrible crime. He deserves more than just a slap on the wrist.

Posted by madmax on October 3, 2008 at 6:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

handyhood: No offense but you sound like a terrible human being. This is coming from a Republican.

Posted by ironwoman on October 3, 2008 at 7:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)

SoSad- Not true, some turn themselves in. Juveniles also run and hide. It goes both ways.

Handyhood is making accurate statements regarding Federal Judges changing what the voters want. It's happening now and it needs to be stopped. They aren't elected officials and they should not dictate what the public vote should be.

Posted by AnnaWhaat on October 6, 2008 at 3:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thinkbeforeyoupost ,Ditto!
hotwildflower ,Great Comment ,now if people can only understand it......crime = yes= adult=NO.
JayRemE,He did take it to school authorities.
slkrchck ,Exactly!!!!!!!!