Posted by christafrankmiller on August 19, 2008 at 5:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

as a military spouse and an american...this makes me livid!! how dare they!!?? if you dont like it here...get the heck out!!
my apologies mr. nolen and thank you for putting one back up...i hope they dont do it again!

Posted by AnnaWhaat on August 19, 2008 at 6:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree with Christa!!!!!!! Fly it high and proud !

Posted by twbeem on August 19, 2008 at 6:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Exactly, I am a veteran and you know if you want to burn the flag you can get the hell out. If you don't know the way out, I'm sure there are tons of flag fliers that will be happy to show you the way out.

Posted by RebelGal on August 19, 2008 at 7:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Love it or leave it. It is so unfortunate that in these stressful times people have to go out and do something so degrading not only to Mr. Nolen but to everyone in this country.

If you are going to burn it, why don't you wrap yourself in it first?

Posted by Hueneme1961 on August 19, 2008 at 7:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree with Christa also Fly it high and proud !

Posted by getreal on August 19, 2008 at 7:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What a disgrace! I have a flag in front of my house and it flies proudly every day, rain or shine.

Posted by Equitable_Enforcer on August 19, 2008 at 8:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Ready for some controversy? My hot button has been pushed.

Pure evil!!! This includes the the perp or perps who burned Mr. Nolen's flag ... and the judges who allow radicals to desecrate our flag all in the name of free speech under some warped interpretation of our constitution.

During Gulf War No. 1 the flag given to me during my Navy retirement ceremony was flying in front of my business. It was illuminated at night per protocol. I arrived at work the first morning after it had flown at night to find the line cut and the flag gone.

Many times during several years of overseas duty, I stood at attention, sometimes with tears in my eyes, during morning or evening colors. The flag continues to have special meaning to me as a symbol of what is right about our country and the brave men and women who have died defending it. If painting a swastika on a synagogue is a hate crime, so should be the theft or desecration of an American flag.

Enough legal fiction. I want my country back.

Posted by Comments on August 19, 2008 at 9:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Equitable_enforcer - I don't think that the free speech defense would apply here. One could make that argument if one had burned their own flag on their own property. That's another discussion. In this instance someone decided to desecrate a flag that belonged to another individual and basically set fire to his house. Much, much different and far graver in my opinion. I can't imagine any defense that would win in this situation.

What a horrible thing for someone to do. If someone wants to make a political statement then there are appropriate ways to do that. This is NOT one of them. I hope they find the person and that s/he goes to jail.

I will continue to fly my flag proudly daily. I can't even imagine what would possess someone to do what his person did.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 9:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This is disgraceful, but is it really a surprise? P.H. is becoming just like its big sister, Oxnard, full of illegal immigrants – those who only want to make a buck north of the border instead of legally waiting to be an American citizen. Then there are those who will never show unconditional love and sole allegiance to America; their hearts are always looking to the south of the border, even those who are born here and are citizens of our great land.

Look at what is now taught in schools. It’s not the sacrifice and valor of our soldiers in foreign wars or the strength of the common man who built this country into what it is today. WWII is just a footnote. It’s now all about how bad America has been; chapter upon chapter in the history books is about the KKK, American imperialism and the genocide of the Native Americans. Little good is now taught about America like how the U.S. stopped Nazi tyranny and the USSR. Never a mention that this is the best country – EVER, and a light of hope to the world.

Look at what the liberal left has put into the minds of our young students. These students, unless they study outside of the course curriculum will never know that the founding fathers themselves had a love for their Creator and used the Judeo-Christian values as the moral basis for our democracy. Students are taught the “separation of church and state” is in the constitution, which it is not – it is a court ruling of the 20th century. The students will never gain a love of country and understanding of sacrifice while these blame America for everything types are in charge, but I see little change. Just look at how many have bought into Obama’s “change” and that America is no longer a great country, but just an oppressor. Listen to what he said at Rick Warren’s church about America.

Expect more flag burnings from these folks…

Posted by cynstriss on August 19, 2008 at 10:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I will never forget July 4th 1979 when I was driving to my brother's house in Oxnard early in the morning. I passed a man in his yard who was putting his flag up the pole placed proudly in his front yard as he has done every day for years. In front of me was a car full of Mexicans, who shouted "Viva la Mexico" at the man, and honked their horn as they sped off. I don't understand why they are living here when they love Mexico so much. They should return to Mexico if they cannot respect our flag and all it represents.

Posted by BeaHappi on August 19, 2008 at 10:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Whoever did this is a dirtbag!

I do have to wonder though if it was the flag that was targeted just for being the US flag or if it was burned because it belonged to Mr. Nolen.

Vandalism in any form is cowardly and wrong! And to burn the US flag...disgusting.

Posted by dom_kenpo on August 19, 2008 at 10:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Most patriotic act I have ever seen was in the 70's. A couple of hippie scum went into center field at Dodger Stadium, and were going to light an American flag during a game. Rick Monday, then playing for the Chicago Cubs, ran and stole the flag from the morons before they were arrested. He still has the flag, and has turned down several offers to purchase it, over 30 years later....

Whoever burned the flag, regardless of where they are from, is vile and putrid scum. My daughter, father, both grandfathers, 3 uncles, and 5 great grandfathers have served in war in defense of the American flag. The actions of this perp are offensive to me in ways I cannot describe.

I'd like to see them come to my place and attempt to burn my flag....

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 10:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

juniormafia_ny -

You sound like a patriot; glad you are my countryman. Unfortunatley, there are those who live in this great land and are not patriots. Immigrants add to this great land, but illegal immigrants take advantage of those waiting in line legally. This very nature makes allegiences questionable.

Also, VC school system has not been subject to an ultra liberal agenda like other public school systems.

Watch, your mouth (post), no need for profanity, even if covered up.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 11:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)

However, juniormafia one of your posts caught me eye: "Actually, most of the atrocities are covered up..."

Atrocities cover up? Huh? No country has ever been more open about past mistakes, so what "atrocities" has this great land covered up?

Lastly, America being the best country EVER is NOT an opinion, but a FACT!!!!!

Posted by bbbdugout on August 19, 2008 at 11:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)

all points well taken - the thing we must be careful of is we retain the right to free expression - which burning an American flag in America is NOT one of them - if they burn it in their country, well that's their business and in their country they have every right to do what they want - oh yeah they can't do that in their country - that's why they come here and do it - Freedom is a privilege not to be taken advantage of - some don't understand that

Posted by NowHearThis on August 19, 2008 at 11:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It was a liberal. Conservatives don't burn the American flag. Burning the flag is a leftist-liberal anti-war, activist thing.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 11:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

cynstriss - that image from 1979 stays with you because it was just plane disgusting. That was 1979....fast forward to 2008.........due to a failed border policy, illegal immigrants cutting in front of the lines of legal immigrants, billions of taxpayers dollars being spent for common colds for emergency rooms visits for illegals and free education, and just the blanted disregard for the American history and our flag things are now much, much worse. I see more Mexican flags in Oxnard than I see American flags - that goes miles to showing where one's heart and allegances lie.

Posted by get_to_work on August 19, 2008 at 11:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree with juniormafia_ny this article NEVER mentions illegals, stop making assumptions. It was probably just some dumb kids messing around.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 11:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

juniormafia -

U.S. history books are all about atrocities, such as the KKK, American imperialism and the genocide of the Native Americans...you know that. Chapter upon chapter...

Now tell me about some major battles of WWII, tell me about the reconstruction of Europe and Japan, tell me how many U.S. soldiers died? For the present, how much aide is the U.S. giving Africa to battle AIDs?

Lastly, FACTS are much more than just historic dates. Obviously, you are not a student of history. Looking at all of the past civilizations and today's world, what other nation has this much opportunity, wealth and generousity? NONE. EVER. If you cannot piece together history and see that this IS THE GREATEST LAND - EVER, then no one can help. If you need a text book page number, then you cannot think for yourself and see the big picture.- - this IS THE GREATEST LAND - EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 11:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)

juniormafia -

You know and I know it because we live here. Compared to most of the world, we live like kings. I have traveled overseas and have seen those who are less fortunate.

The vast majority of the world have never lived like us and would not fully understand. Sure, national pride exists and their is nothing wrong with that - the Olympics are a good example of that. In that aspect you are right, but that was never my point. Looking at our standard of living and international generousity we are in the greatest national of all time. Just the multitudes who want to come here attest to that.

I bet we agree more than we disagree on this issue. Let's not get caught up in splitting hairs.

It may have been just a dumb kid, legal or illegal who burned the flag - we will never know. It is actions like this that bring up other emotions of seeing more Mexican flags than American flags when driving throughout the Nard that hurts and angers us. It brings up memories like cynstriss's post. I never meant to stereo-type; my first comment was towards ONLY illegals and since you love this land I am glad to have you aboard.

Posted by Ironhorse on August 19, 2008 at 11:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I despised the Flag burners in the late 60's and early 70's, and nothing has happened to change my mind since then. To those of you who say that this is an expression of free speech..BULL! Speech is when you open your mouth and noise comes out, or you sit before a keyboard as we are and present your thoughts to others for discussion. The burning of a national symbol is an ACT, (in my opinion, of treason), for which there should be penalties.
To Mr. Nolan, I am not wealthy, but I would be proud to replace your flag for you.
To those of you who would try to make this a race issue, allow me to relate a short story. At a Warbirds airshow, the colors were being presented to the singing of the national anthem. As always, the audience were asked to stand, and the men were asked to remove their cover (hats). A group of five youth near me, dressed in sagging shorts and backwards caps, refused to uncover; and in fact totally ignored the entire affair. An event official asked them to quiet down in respect to the rest of us, and in clear english, they refused, shouted "viva la raza", and threatened the official with arrest for harrasment as a hate crime. Racism can come from all directions, and I'm sick and tired of being called a racist if I disapprove of the actions of another person who happens to be of a different ethnicity.
The bottom line is that burning the Flag is not a racist action, it is the action of a person who disrespects the very nation that is providing him (or her) the best opportunities in the world. As was said in other posts; IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, LEAVE!

Posted by doesntgetit on August 19, 2008 at noon (Suggest removal)

This strikes me a lot. In addition to burning a flag, another insult to this country is when people come here, enjoy the a good life they would never have in their home country and flaunts their native flag on their bumpers or rearview mirrors. I saw a picture on the star of some people fighting for immigrant rights displaying their home country's flag. They even wrote messages on their banners in their native language. If they are here in America and fighting for rights here in America, they should display the American flag and send their message in American language which I thought was English the last time I checked. This is rude!! Generally, we don't go to someone's house and starts demanding the residents of what we think is right for us. I just don't get it.
PS. I am an immigrant.

Posted by Relvd98 on August 19, 2008 at 12:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Question: Where in the article did it state it was an illegal that did this? Proof, anyone?

Posted by butterflygone on August 19, 2008 at 12:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I had to move to the Phoenix area 2 years ago for financial reasons. Last week I was in Anaheim to watch the Angels and the Yankees. It almost brought tears to my eyes during the National Anthem to be there in my fav state, about to watch the Yankees and my favorite Jeter, in the best country and best state on the planet. I'm sure those flag burning bastards had no comprehension of the level of disrespect that was. Coming from an area with 2 Navy bases, most of us are offended because we have friends and family in the military. Our troops are dying out there for what our flag represents and some a-hole is over here disrespecting. We are all patriotic and I can guess that this jerk was not from this area. I know that is an assumption, but with what is going on in the world, most of us can agree that we are all blessed to be living in the USA.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 12:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Camdad101 - well said. They should only be seen as Americans and heros. All of the soldiers bleed the same color. We chat comfortably behind our computers and they are serving and dying for us.

Posted by CAtruckdriver on August 19, 2008 at 12:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The 3rd world mentality is what is ruining a country that fought for its freedoms & pride thru it's people. We may be jumping conclusions about an illegal burning that flag but givin the past we're most likely right. Illegal immigrants or their offspring (not all but most) arent taught to respect others property/homes/vehicles/etc or have pride in where they LIVE, not send their paychecks back home to. Until the very government of the United States removes illlegal TRESSPASSORS from our country this problem of desecration will only get worse as time goes on.

I didnt get my chance to defend my country due to illness but I love my flag & country just like any soldier who has went to the depths of hell to defend it does.. i.e. if you harm my flag, I will harm you!

I saw a t-shirt on a white person just the other day that said: " If Mexico is SO great.. GO BACK!". How fitting.

Posted by getreal on August 19, 2008 at 12:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Jr other illegal immigrants are here most definitely but when was the last time you say an illegal Canadian marching down the street for illegal rights waving his/her flag? Never!

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 12:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Camdad101 has the most well stated and NOW....the funniest post of the day! You put a smile on my face. I was going to just ignore Pogmothoin since he/she is obviously a loon from left field. He, he, good job Camadad101!

Posted by CAtruckdriver on August 19, 2008 at 12:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Junior, I've seen with my own eyes people from Mexico who live here illegaly think they have rights & expect the police to protect them all on the contrary they are commiting a crime thats a tad more serious then a simple jaywalking... I'm not bashing anyone from Mexico, everyone was born somewhere, but GetReal is right, whens the last time you seen anyone else other then a Mexican prancing their countries flag (other then an american flag) around and DEMANDING rights??? I've seen a few British flag stickers on cars before but they sure dont take to the streets & demand rights/welfare/etc. My point was a majority of south-of-the-border immigrants have little respect for the peoples country they are invading.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 12:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

juniormafia - no such thing as "free healthcare". Everything has it's price. Canadians pay much higher taxes for their socialized medicine. Several have come to the U.S. and paid full price for the quality care they could not receive up north under their socialized medicine.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 12:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Illegal immigrants from the Western Hemisphere are singled out due to the size of the group compared to illegals from Eastern Europe and Asia. That large influx from down south cannot be absorbed by this country all at once, has caused citizens to take note and in the process the term illegal has been defined by them. You are right, there are other illegals from Asia, Africa and Europe here as well.

Posted by clementine on August 19, 2008 at 1:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The best clue was left ---- a beer bottle. Doesn't that give you an indication of the person who burnt the flag. Alcoholic, stupid & out-of-it!!!! Maybe next time, he'll set himself on fire.

Posted by whatever on August 19, 2008 at 1:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I am loving this article because I don't have to say a word today, it is all being said for me. I just sit and laugh at the usual defenders who don't know what they are talking about. Citizen you are correct in everything you have said and I applaud you. And as far as Canada's health care, if you really want universal health care then I guess the left wing TV as usual didn't show you the report on what is happening up there. People are waiting weeks for just an MRI, weeks to see a specialist. People are dying with out even getting care. If that doesn't scare you then your hopeless. Go ahead and vote for the elitist this Fall and see what you are really going to get. See what he gives away of your tax dollars and I bet you will be singing a different tune then. But it will be too late by then because you will have voted him in office. I would be scare for what I was wishing for in this election because Obama is only going to use you to get into office. Find that report on Canada, it should scare you. As far as this flag burning, cowards through and through. Low life miserable people who disrespect anything that they don't have. Again Citizen is correct and people are angry and mad.

Posted by Ironhorse on August 19, 2008 at 1:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey, CAtruckdriver; I've been told that a lot of the folks that live south of the dotted line on the map still consider everything west of the Mississippi River and south of the Great Plains to be a part of THEIR country. They think they are recovering, not invading, the southwestern states. If you don't beleive that, go to next year's Cinco-de-Mayo celebration in Tony Villar's City of Refuge, er I mean Angels.

Posted by pjlove10 on August 19, 2008 at 2:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I personaly think it was some stupid kid doing something terribly stupid. Not only did he discrace this great Symbol of our Country, but could of burned down that poor man's house and quite possibly his neighbors as well.

My opinion, I'm all for being proud of your heritage and origins. BUT, if you live here, you better raise up that USA Flag and be proud of it.

Posted by hotwildflower on August 19, 2008 at 2:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Ask a Canadian how long they have to wait for a doctor appointment and ask them when they are diagnosed with cancer how long before they can start chemo...trust me, Canada's socialized medicine is NOT what you think.

As mentioned above, they come here and pay full price to see a doctor sooner.

With the rate that Canada's healthcare is consuming their budget, I believe it is about 5-10 years and it will consume 100% of their budget...it's not working out.

Be thankful you live in CA where healthcare...believe it or not is more obtainable and less expensive than other states in the US.

Just for kicks...look up a quote for health insurance for an individual in New York...and compare it to a similar plan in CA.

BTW, I agree Junior...not sure what I am agreeing too, but had to throw in my two cents there. :)

Posted by Rocket81 on August 19, 2008 at 2:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It could have been one of those scumbags at the fair. The last night at the rodeo when the national anthem was played many immigrants chose to sit or speak loudly in spanish. No matter what your politics, you should have enough character to stand for the country your living in. To make matters worse, they did the rodeo broadcast in spanish and english. I will never take my family to another fair event like that. It is disrespectful. English only, is the solution so all people in America can communicate and burning the flag is never right.

Posted by whatever on August 19, 2008 at 2:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Well when people know what they are talking about it is always nice to let them know they are smart enough to figure out facts and truth. To the People that can't grasp reality I sure wouldn't want to visit that place in your head that you live. It must be crowded up there. Illegals have brought crime after crime and will continue. It is funny how the crime in CA was not like this until the flood gates were ripped open. Have you looked at what CA use to look like? It is shocking what it has become because of the people out to take it over. I know to some truth is hard to swallow but if you take a big gulp of water you might get it all down buddy! Is that enough words for you?

Posted by whatever on August 19, 2008 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Nice try Pogmo the ONLY beautiful flag on poles in the US is Red/White/Blue no other belongs outside of ones house. To do so is disrespectful. But that is what we get from the south. How funny people like to make fun of people on here and degrade truth speakers only to make yourself look good. How sad. The internet is a wealth of information instead of sitting here all day long and posting, seriously read everything you can and search for truth. Find out why the US is the best place to live and if you don't like it I can point my fingers to the place down south. If you are such a defender of the illegals, please join their group and head out. You know who you are. How about I defend the KKK? They were wrong right? Well then how can you sit here and say illegals have any rights when we can prove they are killing innocent American Citizens, it is the exact same thing. I wouldn't defend them nor should you defend the current criminals in our society.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 3:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Camdad101 - Pog is still upset that homosapiens took the land from Neandertals like himself. Why else would someone post something sooooooooo intellectually bankrupt soooooooo liberally/hate America cliche. The quote probably came straight from the MEChA website and its "conquest" of Aztlán (pulling the Southwestern U.S. out of America and calling it Aztlán ---- would sound like treason if it was not so absurd)!

The only post I have seen today that is even remotely anti-America is from Pog (so he could make fun of convervatives wrapped in flags - whatever.....)

The flag was probably burned by a foolish teenager who is part of the Neanderthal/Pog lineage.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 3:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

juniormafia, that's not how I took it. I took it as California once belonging to Mexico (assuming that Pog knows that it was the Spanish who conquered the natives of California and Mexico first would be giving him too much credit)

Let me know when you are having the switch throwing - I'll show up to that.

I think crime has increased due to gangs. Many of these gangbangers come from middle class homes of lazy parents or overworked single moms (who knows what happened to dad). These gangs beat up on the migrant pickers and illegals as well, though there are some illegals in gangs as well.

Posted by luv2sail on August 19, 2008 at 3:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Jr, I read most of your posts, agree with some, laugh at others but to say that health care is free in Canada can only lead me to believe you have never spoke to a Canadian to ask them how free it is.
Ever been to Canada? There tax rate is substantially higher than ours to pay for this "free health care". Also, the old say that you get what you pay for holds more ture here than anywhere. When we design a new medical procedure such as a knee joint, hip or other, any idea where the old technology goes? Canada.
For the record, I was born in Canada, immigrated here legally, served in the US military and have been a tax payer since the age of 11, so let's not start.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 4:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes, I have heard of MS-13 and they are a nasty LA based gang. Doesn't there hand sign come from heavy metal music. I say this because I watch a Nat'l Geographic special on them and their founders were into heavy metal and satanic stuff and the gang itself was just like a joke to them. Apparantely, others took it seriously. The Salvadoreans were "educated" in U.S. prisons, departed by to El Salvador, they caused hell down there and the military took a hard stand against them so they came back to LA. In El Salvador if you have any visible MS-13 tatoos the military police really beat you. Up here, very little. I knew of gangbangers back in the day and the leaders came from nice homes, the drove their parents Escalades, actually their fathers were somewhat protective of their boys who had become gangsters. Strange. They needed a kick in the butt and not coddling.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 19, 2008 at 4:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Whatever:
"the ONLY beautiful flag on poles in the US is Red/White/Blue no other belongs outside of ones house. To do so is disrespectful."

Does that include your Confederate Flag?

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 19, 2008 at 4:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It's absolutely stupid to infer from this article that an illegal immigrant burned this. Stating such demonstrates that you post on here with an agenda.

You don't need to fly a flag to be patriotic.

The US USED TO BE the greatest country in the world....but it is slowly getting discredited by the actions of the current administration over the last 8 years. Sad to say, but that is a FACT. It's more than illegal immigration f'ing this country up, but to do nothing but keep digging ourselves into a bigger hole on a global scale is all that can be expected of a C-Student President such as Dubya. It's going to take more than a US flag to change this country.

That goes for both Obama or McCain.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 5:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It is still the GREATEST country.

It's far from perfect, but if you find a better place I am sure a plane, boat or car can get you there. And don't blame illegal immigration on the price of tickets.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 19, 2008 at 5:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

To those on this thread that believe the US is still the greatest country in the world...here's where the US stacks up on a few key statistics vs. the rest of the world:

Infant mortality rate: America ranks 48th in the world
Overall health: 72nd
Freedom of the press: 44th
Literacy: 55th

Those are key statistics that shouldn't be ignored.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 19, 2008 at 5:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Don't be blind Citizen. You can't keep living in 1955...stop living off of accomplishments from prior generations. The title of "greatest country in the world" is not a birthright.

I'm here to keep fighting the good fight because I think the country can get back up there...but sadly, right now...it's not and you only look silly holding up your "we're number 1 foam finger" when we obviously rank much lower in key categories.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 5:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It is still the GREATEST country.

No one is stopping you from leaving if you find a better place.

The millions who are trying to gain U.S. citizenship attest to the fact that it is the greatest. There is no other country that is as popular with the immigrant crowd.

It is just those who were born here (by no effort of their own) that complain how bad America is today. Travel overseas, open up your mind and thank God that you live here as a citizen with endless opportunities.

There is so much opportunity here for a better life. People such as yourself that just complain are a shame.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 19, 2008 at 5:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Can you not read?

I typed in in English for you. I'm here because I believe the country can get back to where it used to be. For those that choose to come here illegally, this country in their opinion is better than where they were. Is it the best? or the best they can actually get to?

How do you know if I was born here or not. I HAVE been overseas...and seen some pretty content people...just like here. My comments were meant to enlighten you on the facts and how if people in this country are held in check by being told to continue to believe that everythings ok and that it's still the greatest country because everyone flies a flag and we have tanks and guns...everyone will soon have a rude-awakening to the reality of where the administrations have taken us.

If you still don't get it. Then I'll let you go so you can listen to some more Toby Keith.

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 5:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01-

American can always be better, but complaining and making fun of those who know how fortunate we are to be here is shameful.

Where else would you rather be? Seriously. Name the country where you want your baby raise.

You can fight the "good fight" and should, but making fun of us who feel blessed to be here is not the good fight but a shameful act.

You cannot comprehend the opportunities you have for your life because you are a U.S. citizen then no one can help you. The best you can do is volunteer on an overseas mission, or even rural Mexico, and see just how blessed you are to be here. It is a shame to see your comments. It is up to you to make the change for the better and America gives you that opportunity!

Posted by HotModernMom on August 19, 2008 at 5:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01 -

It is really bizarre and strange to see people make fun of those who feel blessed to have a life here in America. You keep mentioning "administration", I assume you mean Bush. I will fight for a good life no matter who is president. I would have felt just as blessed under John Keary.

I think I have heard of Toby Keith. Country, right? Don't like Country music, too twangy. I know you meant this as another insult towards me because I feel blessed to be an American.

Well, just keep the insults coming my way. I still know this is the GREATEST country and I am proud to be an American.

Posted by christafrankmiller on August 19, 2008 at 7:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)

i think this country would be a whole lot better off with all the "haters" gone...thats for sure...americas not perfect, but its MY country...my husband fights for it and it has taken many things from my family...thats what makes me so mad...everyone wants the freedoms and rights, but noone wants to pay the price and/or flat out dont care who is paying the price for their wasting of precious oxygen!! i certainly dont agree with everything in this country, but i wouldnt rather be anywhere else...unless of course obama or billary become pres...then i might head elsewhere...people are just so spoiled...try seeing and living in what our soldiers have to see and live in...permanently...the grass is greener on the other side...so go to it!!!

Posted by nelsonknows on August 19, 2008 at 10:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy, I suggest you pack your bags and baminos, pronto then, don't run your mouth, don't give anyone some excuse, just leave.

Posted by VOR on August 19, 2008 at 11:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

And let us not forget when they took down the U.S. flag that was flying over the Maywood (sanctuary city) Post Office and raised a Mexican flag. Sounds like the militia should have been called in, the post office was under attack.

Perhaps this is why China built the great wall.

Posted by AnnaWhaat on August 20, 2008 at 7:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Citizen , I agree! Check out the other states and compare......
Love it or leave it.........how hard is that?

Posted by Why on August 20, 2008 at 10:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

to everyone who says they "know" that illegal and legal immigrants don't hold America and it's laws to the highest standard. you probably don't know may of these people that is apperent from your statments. i am the son of an "illegal immigrant" and a american citizen who's parents are from mexico. I guess i'm an "anchor" baby too? I've lived here for 25 years, all my life i've been through public educatioin, college and have a great job that i love. developed tons of friends of all different races. they should probably send me back with all the other "mexicans." right? you can't send all illegal immigrants back to there contries. not only because i doubt you'd be able to catch half of them. we can't catch one guy in afganistan what makes you think we can catch millions here and send em all back. think about the personal and money needed to pull something like this off let alone all the legal battles that will insue after. anyways back to topic, bringing up immigration on this article is ludacris. I know many different kinds of people i pride myself in my ability to befriend people of all types. let me just say this. I know of a lot more people american citizens that probably would have done this atrocity against the american flag before any illegal immigrant. many americans are livid with the country and they ways things have gone in the past 8 years. until change is brought it's only going to continue to get worse.

Posted by Why on August 20, 2008 at 10:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Don't get my words twisted. I love this country. And will defend "EVERYTHING" it stand for and provides for me and all U.S. citizens.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 20, 2008 at 11:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)

You people are stubborn. I fully realize the opportunities in this country. I call you stubborn because you fail to realize that running around proclaiming the U.S. is the greatest country does not make it so. Choosing people to lead the country not because of the bible they thump, but because they have the common sense and intelligence to make the best decisions for the country and not their family's investment portfolio are a few steps that people can take to improve the U.S.'s current position in the world.

Going to war and sacrificing the precious lives of the courageous soldiers risking their lives for a B.S. cause (and it's NOT for our freedom people....open your eyes and ears...that's just what they're told to keep them motivated), that just puts the U.S. two steps backwards, instead of forwards. Those soldiers could be here battling the gang problems we have in this country rather than fighting overseas to secure oil pipelines. Think about all those young lives lost and permanently injured that could have contributed to the potential rebound of this country. Realize that you and I can imagine how great an impact they would have made, but the current administration is BEYOND thinking of the people (you and I). They could really care less (don't be blind to that).

My point is, just standing and regurgitating that the U.S. is the greatest country is the world is not making it so. I never said that I don't like this country and wish to live elsewhere, I'm just making the point that the people (in a democracy) should have the ability to make a difference by who they elect and who they can kick out of office for ruining our country with their lack of common sense and bad judgement. (CA kicked out Davis and elected the Governator and we're STILL in a mess...in fact...isn't the state budget one of the reasons we kicked out Davis???? Some people just don't THINK before they vote.)

That's all I'm saying.

Posted by Hueneme1961 on August 20, 2008 at 12:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Just another day in " the friendly city by the sea"

Posted by Metalhaid on August 20, 2008 at 1:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I fully support the right of people to burn the U.S. flag--if they are wrapped up in it and doused in gasoline first. Hope they catch this incestuous fornicator and have a lynching. Why are our young people fighting and dying for scumbags like this? I wish they'd designate a large lump of ice in Antarctica as the Anti-America Free Zone and send all the people who hate the US there.

Posted by blonderunner on August 20, 2008 at 1:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree with everyone here. I don't ever support burning the flag. If someone hates it here so much, get out of the country, we don't want you here. Stories like this truly make me sick- how can you not support the country you live in?!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 20, 2008 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Why:

Per what CAMDAD said, how in the world did you get away with not paying for Sales Taxes evertime you shop in your city and how did you not pay for your mortgage (if you own) and thus your property taxes in your county and how did you get away with working and paying state income taxes, but according to CAMDAD, you didn't pay for your education? Hey wait, that's right...even illegal immigrants pay sales taxes (just like CAMDAD), property taxes by way of paying rent to someone who pays their property taxes with that money (CAMDAD pays these property taxes too) and state income taxes are being withheld from even illegal immigrants that use false social security #s (just like CAMDAD's state income taxes).

So how exactly is the education being provided 100% free to these individuals???? Please explain instead of generalize.
(this was directed more at CAMDAD than WHY, BTW)

Posted by iam_caine on August 20, 2008 at 4:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Every citizen has a constitutional right to burn the flag, but for cryin' out loud, burn your own damn flag, not some else's!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 20, 2008 at 4:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yeah...sorry this guy's property was damaged. I'd even venture to guess that it was not meant as a political statement more than vandalism. Again, I'm guessing.

Posted by Why on August 20, 2008 at 4:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

CamDad:
not sure if you went to school or know how to read. but i was born here my mother was born here how am i illegal? my parents paid for my education along with stafford LOANS which means i have to pay them back. please let me know how YOU paid for MY education? I have a valid social and so does my mom and dad for that matter since he is a naturalized amarican citizen. so not sure where you come from with your comments.

Posted by Why on August 20, 2008 at 4:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

CamDad:
one more thing. I AM HOME!!!!!!

Posted by opns on August 20, 2008 at 4:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Equitable_Enforcer - Pushing that button!!
I respect our american flag, and like many here said, back before the 80's the american flag stood firm and strong, it was in the mid 70's when disrespect started with our Flag. How dare they...i remember as a little girl, viewing all of the casualities during the vietnam war, it was endless, upon endless, i would ask my mom, what that was all about, then i would remind myself to turn on the tv so that i could see all of the casualities, just so that i can mourn, and grieve and pray to god and be grateful for my country and those who served. To this day, i still cry remembering how the list went on and on and on. then i went to washington dc and saw the wall. i'm sorry, the emotions are getting carried away here. so when i hear people bashing our us troops, and the homeless who served, i feel the pain. no one absolutely no one should allowed in this country with the feelings like this towards our country. total disrespect. i say boot anyone out after a good slashing.
Sincerely

Posted by opns on August 20, 2008 at 5:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Oh, and by the way, i worked with so many of these veterans, it was a great place to work then, because we were all empowered by our country, and the product we were building in defence of our country. to this day, i will always remember this job because of the loyal veterans that i worked with. it was an honor. honor is something that is desperately lacking due to new comers in our country. the long battles and the scars to show from our generation from the previous generations. anything, this is just another one of my strong convictions. i hope that people from our countries are understanding our passion for whom we stand. my father faught in the korean war, carried a basuga, and was a drill saergent.

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 12:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It is so good to see folks from both sides of the political spectrum uniting in their anger at anyone desecrating our flag and committing vandalism. For a few moments we are a country, undivided again and THAT feels good to me! Thank You ALL!

Posted by Why on August 21, 2008 at 8:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Why: This is what you wrote: "i am the son of an "illegal immigrant" and a american citizen who's parents are from mexico. I guess i'm an "anchor" baby too?"

What part of I am the son fo an illegal immigrant AND an AMERICAN CITIZEN!!! did you not understand. did you not read the american citizen part? or did you just decide to leave that out. Sorry for the bad grammar didn't realize i was being graded on this.

Posted by jeffreys49 on August 21, 2008 at 9:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)

the USA is the greatest and always will be. We should all be proud that you have the freedom to sit and write threads like this. My father a Vietnam veteran , Myself a veteran of many SOCOM missions, My brother received two purple hearts in Iraq My mother a Holoucost survivor and all of us will fly the US flag with pride until you've been in those Boots or lived through those horrors you will never know what those stars and strips mean. Thats not to say that your not a proud American but only those who have been there will understand. A very important leader of the modern wold once said " You can judge the greatness of a country by all that want to immigrate there" so say what you want fact/not fact, . As far as burning this mans flag being burned most likely kids or teenagers who grew up in a system where pledging allegiance to the flag is not done any more because it violates rules and laws and rights of others. To those out there you've all heard love it or leave it well if you have an issue with this government take your flag if you have one to the Visa office and drop it off when you leave hope all works out at your new homeland.

Posted by opns on August 21, 2008 at 9:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The long long rooted americans are the best - and you can hear the great passion and convictions. I just love it. I pray the the others take great heed, because there is no county better than the United States of America.
I'm sure in a heartbeat me and so many others of this country would gladly escourt (you people) who really hate our country. How dare you even be here.

(will i get in trouble for saying- you people)?

Posted by opns on August 21, 2008 at 9:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Aawee camdad, i knew you had it in you. I respect you for that camdad. Good for you!!!!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 21, 2008 at 10:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Once again...NO ONE EVER SAID they HATE this country. Please learn to read for comprehension.

As far as the pledge of allegiance, I believe that was being challenged and eventually taken out because of the reference to GOD and NOT what the pledge itself stood for. A slight change in the wording for those who do not believe in GOD would have kept it in schools. Again, no compromise from certain people caused for it to be eliminated. As far as keeping "God" in it, what happened to seperation between church and state? Guess we can just pick and choose what models to use when running a country. Huh.

Posted by Why on August 21, 2008 at 10:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

CamDad: apology accepted. i'd have to say some of these topics are touchy and get people riled up. This is exactly why I love this country. We are ALL free people protected by the constitution free to speak our minds. i apologize also for any comments made out of anger or spite. just glad we can all discuss these topics like adults. :-)

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 12:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

CamDad101, I misread Why's post also so don't think you are the only one who did. I salute you sir, it takes a real man (or woman if that be the case) to apologize.

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 1:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01
The preamble to the California Constitution reads as follows;
We, the People of the State of California, grateful to Almighty God for our
freedom, in order to secure and perpetuate its blessings, do establish this
Constitution.
The preambles to 48 States' Constitutions mention God, so does our money which is a requirement by federal law, In God We Trust is our National Motto, again passed by Congress and the Pledge of Allegiance, as it is said today, is part of Federal Code Title 36.
Actually the Establishment Clause was first recognized in 1947 in Everson v Board of Education and is in reference to an out of context interpretation of the Danbury letters of 1801-02 between Thomas Jefferson and the Danbury Baptist Church Association of Connecticut. (The separation of church and state being the separation of the State's Church and the State of Connecticut) Note; Thomas Jefferson had nearly nothing to do with the formation and writing of the Bill of Rights to the Constitution, those being written by James Madison (Jefferson was minister to France from 1785 to 1789, he was not able to attend the Philadelphia Convention).

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 21, 2008 at 2:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

nelsonknows:
The separation of church and state is a legal and political principle derived from the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, which reads, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof . . ."

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 2:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BabyzDaddy_01, read that, "CONGRESS" shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. There IS NO mention of Separation of church and state anywhere in our Constitution, the ONLY mention of a separation of church and state is contained in the Danbury Letters which have absolutely no jurisdiction to the Constitution. The Establishment Clause, which is derived from those Danbury Letters, is about as farcical as basing law on a letter someone wrote to their mother.
Congress will not make a national church, congress will not prohibit anyone's freedom to practice their religion. That's ALL the First Amendment says on religion.

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 21, 2008 at 2:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" means they shall not acknowledge a particular regligion (a lot of religions believe there is a GOD) when creating laws. That in turn means enforcing and/or creating laws. The arguments arise in the interpretation of those words. To me, this is what it says, to you, those words are not specific enough to mean "a seperation between church and state". I'm not saying that LITERALLY, the constitution says that "seperation between church and state" (I'm aware that those words were usedin in teh Danbury Letters)...I'm saying that GOD and/or the belief in GOD should have NOTHING to do with how this country is run and how the laws are applied and/or created. That's all I'm saying. I acknowledge that those very words in that order are not in the constitution, I'm merely saying that this is how I interpret those words (and, yes, that's arguable, but not definite one way or the other).

Posted by opns on August 21, 2008 at 3:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

i click on this page - and camdad is singing - what a picture i envisioned.
don't know what you look like, but i envision you as this big big guy, with a large beard, harley kind, with the leather biker kind; happily singing
(too much)

LOL LOL LOL your so hysterical.

All together now....

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

James Madison said himself that "shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" meant just that, the United States would have no national Church, as there had been in England with the Church of England. The First Amendment can also be interpreted as Congress has no right to make any law that involves religion, or that Congress cannot establish a religion. The Amendment also pertains to Congress and has no jurisdiction over a State or any other body of Government.

Posted by nelsonknows on August 21, 2008 at 3:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

thanks CamDad, now I've spit coffee all over my screen!

Posted by BabyzDaddy_01 on August 21, 2008 at 3:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Ok...then why the need to acknowledge a GOD? (this is for the sake of debate, not that my opinions will alter anything...just always wondered about this). If there isn't a national church or national religion, then why include the "under God" in the pledge. That automatically alienates those that don't believe in God. I even wondered this as a kid, "What about those that don't believe in God?" I asked. My Teacher said, "you MUST include it otherwise you're not pledging allegiance to the nation". WTF?! Guess that's why I also don't fly a flag, but still feel good about all the opportunities in this country while still being able to acknowledge there's room for improvement and that we could be the greatest once again if only those issues were addressed. Somehow, that keeps getting interpreted as "I Hate the country"...which is far from the truth.

Posted by opns on August 21, 2008 at 4:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ESP - strange you mention that - i've told told that i should look into that. I've envisioned others here by what they say and their poster name - i think that was just luck.
I think everyone has some ESP -- but i'll have to say - when i dream of an earthquake, they they come 2-3 weeks later. i've had other strange cooincidences.
I wish some people had ESP to find these criminals. I would love to do this.

Posted by jeffreys49 on August 22, 2008 at 9:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

On the point of flying the Mexican flag heres one for you I do a lot of motocross riding with my family around California and always see mexican flags on Atv's and trailers and trucks at our National /State parks. My 12 year old son asked me last weekend why do so many of the quads and toy-boxes fly the mexican flag???
I told I was'nt sure but most likely because they are proud to be mexicans , He then asked if I thought they came here from mexico with all the Quads,Bikes, Huge lifted crew cab trucks , fifth wheel trailers nicer than my house and my answer was NO WAY they earned all those things in AMERICA our System has provided anyone tools to have all you can in this great country. The flying of any other countries flag is OK as long as its in the proper location below the American flag and if you choose not to respect the land that your in at the time shows your ignorance and disrespect

Posted by eguzie on August 22, 2008 at 2:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I dont know why mexican flags are the only one being mentioned. I have seen many other flags out ther, Puerto Rican flags, Italian flags, even Cuban flags! Anywho, this article doesnt even mention mexicans or the mexican flags, or any other flags.... so drop it.

And i hope they catch the dirtbag who did this and throw his sorry butt in jail

Posted by Dave on August 22, 2008 at 3:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thank you everyone.

It is a shame that someone would do such a thing to the flag that represents the men and women the died to defend our freedom, witch so many including myself take for granted every day.

As for the beer bottle the 3 police that responded just felt the beer bottle to see how cold it was. They didnt have any intrest in it, and left it behind when they left. So now it is my recycling bin untill it becomes full.

Thank you,
Dave

ps: thank a vet

Posted by wzupnow on August 23, 2008 at 8:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Wow, this article is about OUR FLAG being burned in front of someones home. This has nothing to do with immigrantion or healthcare.

I agree with (get to work), it was probably some a dumb person whith a bad idea. Trying to blame this on race, immigration, religion, or healthcare is crazy.

Thanks to all those who fly the flag and fly it proudly. Thanks to all those who have served and currently serve.

Posted by West_to_East on September 24, 2008 at 12:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You know as a kid I didn't have use to the National Anthem, but when I joined the military I learned the meaning of the words of the song. The flag doesn't represent the first 13teen states or the colors of America. It represents the soldiers who have fought in Vietnam, WWI, WWII, Pearl Harbor and on and on and the current war on Terrorism. It represents the soldiers who were killed, the soldiers who are scared for life and the familiy's of lost and scared soldiers.

So thanks to the ******* that did that because you just slapped all these people in the face and discraced your country. PLUS TO BAD THEY DIDN'T GET CAUGHT BECAUSE THAT IS A FEDERAL OFFENSE TO BURN AN AMERICAN FLAG

Posted by chevyc10805 on October 3, 2008 at 12:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)

as i started reading everybody's comments it just saddens me a lot how we have so many ignorant people with nothing else to do than just talk smack about illegal immigrants...this whole topic was about a person that lost a flag to a idiot that burned it...why is it that their are people that always start pointing fingers when they dont even know who it is? i come from parents that are mexican...and yes i too im very upset of that person that burned that flag...but for all those people pointing fingers when they dont know who it is, is just plain stupid!
thing, before you type! it could have been anybody from any race...so please people think before you comment!!!